tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post4320552769062565905..comments2023-11-02T04:21:10.340-04:00Comments on The way the Ball bounces: The Great Debate: Does God Exist?BallBounceshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-79367135916632509692012-07-12T10:20:08.184-04:002012-07-12T10:20:08.184-04:00RkBall,
Which of what I said was wrong? I listene...RkBall,<br /><br />Which of what I said was wrong? I listened to the debate and that's what I heard.<br /><br />Well, of course the biblical God can account for all of that. An omnipotent being, by definition, can account for EVERYTHING. That's why it has no explanatory power whatsoever.<br /><br />If you just invoke God for everything you can't explain, then it's semantically equivalent to just saying "I don't know".<br /><br />Bahnsen made the much bigger jump from deism to Christianity. He just summarily dismissed all other possible cosmogonies to manufacture a false dilemma between no God and the biblical God.Ganoes Parannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-73331687321185457372012-07-12T09:28:57.053-04:002012-07-12T09:28:57.053-04:00Ganoes Paran - It is indeed poor reasoning -- but ...Ganoes Paran - It is indeed poor reasoning -- but it is your caricature of Bahnsen; it is not the argument he makes. <br /><br />I do agree that Bahnsen makes the jump from theism to specifically Christianity rather quickly, but I think the rationale is that the portrayal of God within the pages of the Old and New Testament matches the God who must be there to give an adequate account of creation, logic, universals, etc.BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-70084267646986273362012-07-12T07:58:47.749-04:002012-07-12T07:58:47.749-04:00Bahnsen's proof simply seems to be "natur...Bahnsen's proof simply seems to be "nature is uniform and logic is objective and universal, well my belief, Christianity, includes a God that created a uniform universe, and universal and objective logic; therefore, my God exists and Christianity is true".<br /><br />This is really poor reasoning.<br /><br />We don't absolutely know if nature is uniform, though it seems to be. We don't even know if our reality is just an illusion. But we've got to start somewhere - nature is uniform and what we sense is the same as what other people sense, if we so choose.<br /><br />Logic was created and developed by man. If we've discovered or tapped into some objective and universal system or structure, nobody knows.<br /><br />Even if nature is indeed uniform, and logic is indeed objective and universal, that doesn't mean a God is necessary. How Bahnsen made the leap to the Christian God is just confirmation bias and asinine.Ganoes Parannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-2459473585754082132012-06-20T17:59:53.207-04:002012-06-20T17:59:53.207-04:00And this degree of cognitive dissonance is what al...And this degree of cognitive dissonance is what allows people to believe in utter nonsense.<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-83305653564039631502012-06-20T11:47:10.446-04:002012-06-20T11:47:10.446-04:00Or, to put it this way:
This: "'Paradox...Or, to put it this way: <br /><br />This: "'Paradoxically, being a Nazi may have been the best thing that happened to Heinrich, since it led to his salvation.'"<br /><br />Does not equal this: "becoming a Nazi was possibly the best thing some people could do, as it led to their salvation."BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-51025114960628025012012-06-20T11:31:18.732-04:002012-06-20T11:31:18.732-04:00Steven, I'm going to try saying this one more ...Steven, I'm going to try saying this one more time, slowly.<br /><br />1. Becoming a Nazi is not a good thing.<br />2. Becoming a paraplegic is not a good thing.<br />3. Getting in a car crash and being maimed is not a good thing.<br /><br />However, God can bring good out of evil. If a person comes to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ because of becoming a Nazi, a paraplegic, or being maimed, that is a good thing. No one is advocating that you become a Nazi, or go off in your car at a high speed in order to be maimed.<br /><br />And I suspect you know this as would any reasonable third party reading this exchange. But you seem to have an irrational hate-on for William Lane Craig that has blinded your judgment.BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-48514364782400722852012-06-20T11:15:59.943-04:002012-06-20T11:15:59.943-04:00No you didn't.
What Craig said was absurd. Yo...No you didn't.<br /><br />What Craig said was absurd. You pointed out that yourself.<br /><br />The fact that Craig's position leads to absurdities cannot be refuted by confirming the absurd nature of what was said.Steven Carrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983601793874190779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-80277019905879662402012-06-20T09:24:02.371-04:002012-06-20T09:24:02.371-04:00I didn't say you mis-quoted him; I said you --...I didn't say you mis-quoted him; I said you -- you -- misrepresent what he said. Which you have. And I illustrated how.BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-37325156649030295352012-06-20T08:27:55.103-04:002012-06-20T08:27:55.103-04:00No, I reported Craig's exact words.
Which wou...No, I reported Craig's exact words.<br /><br />Which would you rather do, burn in Hell or have a swimming accident?<br /><br />Craig claimed that the reason that becoming a Nazi was a good thing was that they committed such atrocities that some of them were so horrified by what they had done and so repented and were saved.Steven Carrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983601793874190779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-9018846033955975492012-06-20T07:46:33.772-04:002012-06-20T07:46:33.772-04:00Steven -- you misrepresent what Craig actually sai...Steven -- you misrepresent what Craig actually said, as your quotation makes abundantly clear. Joni Erickson became a Christian as a result of a swimming accident which left her a quadriplegic. One might say, paradoxically, this was a good thing that happened to her. This is not the same as advocating that people should dive into a shallow pool and become quadriplegic. So, I really don't know what point, if anything, you think you are making.BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-23373564212670642122012-06-20T05:02:13.875-04:002012-06-20T05:02:13.875-04:00William Lane Craig recently wrote about how becomi...William Lane Craig recently wrote about how becoming a Nazi was possibly the best thing some people could do, as it led to their salvation.<br /><br />As the owner of this blog won't believe Craig wrote such a thing, here are Craig's exact words 'Paradoxically, being a Nazi may have been the best thing that happened to Heinrich, since it led to his salvation.'Steven Carrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983601793874190779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-15540803653652122922012-06-17T19:18:48.534-04:002012-06-17T19:18:48.534-04:00Joe, the very fact that there are 35000 different ...Joe, the very fact that there are 35000 different sub-sects of your cult, and that each one of those sub-sects claims that they are the only ones who know what "true christianity" is, should be a flashing neon sign telling you that NONE of you know what "true christianity" is; in fact, it should be a flashing neon sign on top of a lighthouse that an invisible omnipotent being had nothing whatsoever to do with the writing of your cult's fairy tales, otherwise it would have been written without an encyclopaedia's worth of contradictions, immorality, and falsehoods. As Samuel Clemens wrote, your little magic book contains "upwards of a thousand lies".<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-21294323125094161372012-06-17T16:33:24.139-04:002012-06-17T16:33:24.139-04:00Wow since Same Dumb Comment lost the 'magic ma...Wow since Same Dumb Comment lost the 'magic man in the sky' argument he has latched onto his 'magic book' argument. Of course being only semi-literate and hermeneutically clueless getting into any kind of a discussion with him is pointless. That being said I wonder if Same Dumb Comment ever notices the number of different Christian denominations. If he is capable of noticing that, I wonder if he realizes that the reason there are so many different denominations is because there are many many many different interpretations of the Holy Bible. In fact within every Church there are as many interpretations of the Bible as there are people sitting in the pews. Truth be told Christians re-evaluate their understanding of the Bible as they mature in the faith. Same Dumb Comment keeps coming up with the interpretation a 5 year old might have which shows Same Dumb Comment's lack of maturity and genuine thought. But then again his arguing style is similar to that of a 5 year old so what can we expect.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17314193532768891832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-14238765047184348422012-06-17T14:23:50.940-04:002012-06-17T14:23:50.940-04:00It's not my fault if your cult's own littl...It's not my fault if your cult's own little magic book contradicts your claims, Joe, it's your fault for not knowing what you claim to believe in.<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-1051669724460182982012-06-17T14:21:52.208-04:002012-06-17T14:21:52.208-04:00As I recall, when pushed into a corner, SDC's ...As I recall, when pushed into a corner, SDC's response is, "just is". When a Christian is pushed into a corner, their response is "God". I'll take God as a more robust metaphysical explanation for existence -- physical, mental, social, moral, and spiritual -- than "just is". Dirt. Water. Stir. Beethoven. Mozart. Shakespeare. Jesus.BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-89809409258647729902012-06-17T14:10:38.657-04:002012-06-17T14:10:38.657-04:00You know Same Dumb Comment sometimes discussing Bi...You know Same Dumb Comment sometimes discussing Biblical hermeneutics with you is like taking a child to a Shakespearean play. The child, that's you Same Dumb Comment, laughs at the silly bits but throughout remains completely oblivious to the mature adult themes William Shakespeare was exploring.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17314193532768891832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-27958386526582628512012-06-17T10:51:21.055-04:002012-06-17T10:51:21.055-04:00And John, if you had any sort of an intelligent ar...And John, if you had any sort of an intelligent argument for the existence of your superstition's imaginary invisible magic man in the sky, you would have presented it already; enjoy your delusions, wingnut.<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-70599157292943402502012-06-17T10:49:28.207-04:002012-06-17T10:49:28.207-04:00You haven't bothered to read your cult's l...You haven't bothered to read your cult's little magic book, Joe? It claims that your imaginary invisible magic man in the sky is 1) invisible (except in certain circumstances), 2) magic (through being able to perform "miracles"), and 3) male (because "man" was supposedly "created" in "HIS" image). If you've got any more misconceptions about your insane superstition, let me know, OK :-)<br /> You insane religionists remind me of children who cling to a security blanket in the belief that it will protect them from monsters under the bed, and who "explain" things by reflexively saying "magic man in the sky done it" without even bothering to look for the REAL answer. Remind me how well that worked out for every OTHER thing that your cult has used it as an excuse for, Joe, ranging from earthquakes (see above), lightning, disease, death, storms, eclipses, moving lights in the sky, and everything else. The more we learn about EVERYTHING, the further back your imaginary "god" has to run.<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-29923631814967979142012-06-17T10:04:10.779-04:002012-06-17T10:04:10.779-04:00"REDUCED to forging posts?"
Nope, I'..."REDUCED to forging posts?"<br /><br />Nope, I'm not REDUCED to anything. <br /><br />I realize the waste of time and futility of any debate with a nut like you. You will not accept ANY evidence or arguement so why bother?<br /><br />Forging your signature is simply a fun, easy, and quick way of ridiculing you so what the heck?johnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-11109722987899094082012-06-17T01:11:25.179-04:002012-06-17T01:11:25.179-04:00Atheists and their tales of origins somehow remind...Atheists and their tales of origins somehow remind me of an archeologist who spots the Little Mermaid statue in the Copenhagen harbour and declares, "Look at what ocean waves have formed". Or the tourist who enters the Sistine Chapel and wonders out loud about what the roof was made of that the rain water came through it and left such a wonderful image on the ceiling. The more layers the scientific community peels back on our understanding of all that is the less and less suitable is the atheist's outlook. The brilliant intricacy and overlapping redundancy that serves to maintain stasis can only be the product of a mind far far far beyond our ken.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17314193532768891832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-42247240219308502222012-06-16T18:01:16.209-04:002012-06-16T18:01:16.209-04:00OK Same Dumb Comment lets try this from the start ...OK Same Dumb Comment lets try this from the start AGAIN. I'll type really really slowly since you obviously have great difficulty understanding. <br /><br />I don't believe in a magic man in the sky. <br /><br />Yahweh is not magic. Yahweh is not a man. Yahweh is not in the sky. <br /><br />Sorry to disappoint you but please feel free to carry on with your two big buckets of nothing. Any sign of reaching singularity yet?Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17314193532768891832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-68061690471824055202012-06-16T15:25:24.048-04:002012-06-16T15:25:24.048-04:00You don't have to be stupid to believe in magi...You don't have to be stupid to believe in magic and an invisible magic man in the sky, Joe, but it sure does help, doesn't it?<br />SDCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-90497899866596481702012-06-15T22:52:49.784-04:002012-06-15T22:52:49.784-04:00You think there is a Same Dumb Comment and an Anti...You think there is a Same Dumb Comment and an Anti Same Dumb Comment Richard? I never thought of that. <br /><br />I thought that Same Dumb Comment was doing a Screwtape, you know, getting more shrill and smaller as one failure after another besets him. <br /><br />I should have guessed though. Anti Same Dumb Comment is far too honest in his 'self appraisal' to be the same poster as Same Dumb Comment.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17314193532768891832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-84679963190339410232012-06-15T22:31:36.795-04:002012-06-15T22:31:36.795-04:00There's a real SDC and an anti-SDC?!There's a real SDC and an anti-SDC?!BallBounceshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776039024486455199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20385137.post-44820078491546811282012-06-15T22:15:53.101-04:002012-06-15T22:15:53.101-04:00Reduced to forging posts now, John? If you can'...Reduced to forging posts now, John? If you can't make any sort of rational argument for your superstition, that should tell you that it's NONSENSE :-)<br />(the real SDC)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com